[SATLUG] So much for Google being your friend.

David Kowis dkowis at shlrm.org
Fri Jun 4 09:49:15 CDT 2010


On 6/4/2010 8:42 AM, pcdls wrote:
> On 6/4/2010 7:48 AM, David Kowis wrote:
>> On 6/4/2010 1:22 AM, pcdls wrote:
>>   
>>> Pretty much saw this coming.  Hope none of you have made any
>>> compromising searches....at least, not intentionally.
>>>
>>> http://www.pcworld.com/article/197955/google_relents_will_hand_over_european_wifi_data.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hopefully, Texas law should have some interesting counter-measures to
>>> deal with their goofiness (it does).
>>>      
>> Because they kept the data, or because they're caving into the
>> government's demands?
>>
>> Just curious as to what you see the core problem being.
>>
>> Personally, if you've got open unencrypted wifi, and someone collects
>> your packets, shame on you. It's like shouting in a room, and getting up
>> set when someone writes down what you're saying...
>>
>> David
>>
>>    
> Core problem:  There is a continuous and relentless effort to justify
> these sorts of actions.  Where does it end?
> 
> I love analogies!!!
> 
> It's like having a private conversation and someone has bugged your
> phone to write down what you're saying.  Silly rabbit!!  Stop using your
> phone!

I don't think that using an unencrypted wifi is like having a bugged
phone... One is physical compromise of the phone, and the other is
un-affected by any third party at all.

> 
> It's like leaving the door to your house unlocked so that people with
> poor manners and a lack of decency can just come in whenever they feel
> like it to check out what you're doing...and then report it.  Always
> keep your house in lockdown and trust noone!

Yes, but you don't broadcast things outside your home. A better analogy
is if you left the door open and then complained because people took
pictures inside your house from across the street. They're trespassing
on your property, which they had to physically enter. You don't have
similar restrictions with wifi, anyone with an antenna can pick up
stuff, often from a long way away.

> 
> It's like going about in public, being deliberately followed, and
> watched ( ala cointelpro )...but, hey, you're in public!  Stop going out
> in public!

Well it is public. You can take measures to hide, but people can follow
and watch you all they want. If you don't want to be looked at, and
watched, take steps to protect yourself.

> 
> I suspect, as time goes on, the next statements to come from the
> apologists will be:  "Hey, we can't help that no matter how hard people
> try to encrypt their data or their communications, we will always have
> the keys!"  And, when that statement is made.  Will we accept it?

I'm a big proponent of privacy, but it doesn't work out in this
situation, because it's not like bugging your wifi adaptor. You're
broadcasting everything to everyone. If you want what you're doing kept
secret, don't use wifi, or at the very least, keep it encrypted.

I'm not justifying their actions. I asked a question, which you never
answered. Breaking the crypto that you're using is far different than
picking up unencrypted wifi. Listening to the packets is far different
from bugging your wifi to collect the data. You're broadcasting into
open space every time you use wifi, encrypted or not.

David


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